Tuning....Secrets

[deseipel]

A fine article describing how a lower tuned drum can get you more tone and better sound. Secrets from Manu K in part 1. Part 2 is Carter B.

http://www.tbrucewittet.com/2011/06/dru ... rd-part-i/


I've been experimenting with lower tunings recently and they seem more natural and satisfying, imo.

a blurb:

"...I hung with Manu backstage at the Ottawa Ottawa International Jazz Festival in June, 2010. Following salutations, news, and weather, we ventured from the artist trailer to his kit. I sat on his hi-hat side and watched as he changed road-weary pitted batter heads for brand new white coated Ambassadors. While observing his tuning ritual I went from veteran to novice. To me, this is what it’s all about. What a pleasure to watch a master musician go about his work and be affected to such an extent that it changes the way I view my instrument and the “right way” to tune. Sometimes the best thing in life is not cruising forward but, rather, twisting and turning...."

[Josiah]

cool article

ive always loved to spend time with each drum and see where it best sings, up close and/or far away. its invariably been toward the lower tuning spectrum. amb over amb all day.

be interesting to see the carter part, he often has a ton of processing on his drum sound, studio and live

[Gaddabout]

In the author's attempt to break down condescension, he comes off a little condescending himself. It's great to get a perspective on how Manu or CB tunes their drums, but I'm not sure that makes them any more of an authority on the subject than the author.

Tuning is so much how you hit the drums. Unless you hit like Manu, you're never going to sound like Manu.

In the early 80s Gadd used two-ply heads and tuned somewhat low. But you could tune just like him with the exact same kit and still never approach his sound because it's hard to reproduce how HARD he hits his toms -- often with the butt of his sticks. I've watched guys lose their hair trying to reprodcue that sound but they just don't get it. Gadd's moved to the coated heads but he still SOUNDS LIKE GADD. It's amazing.

I think it's critical for young drummers to learn as many techniques as possible, but to also spend as much time experimenting on their own and getting feedback -- particularly from recording themselves both live and in the studio (when possible). The sooner kids figure out every drum is unique, every head is unique, and the way they hit the drums is unique, they can stop fretting over trying to achieve a "pro" sound and start focusing on being a pro that gets a great sound.

[Jean-Paul]

I agree with you Gaddabout. But it's good to get inspiration from "the boys" to step away from the usual.

I have tuned my toms way too long like I heard them on recordings. Higher pitched, short sustain which was also great for light guys who are pretending they can mix a band as well. No overtones, no feedback or whatsoever.

No I am more focusing on tone and tune lower than I used to. Basically, watching an old Weckl instruction vid about tuning opened my eyes. (It sat there in my DVD collection for a long time already.) Boooooooom.

[Christopher]

I liked the article. Not sure I’m drinking the Kool-Aid though. Playing wise, I’ve found tuning really low makes things feel much less responsive and somewhat mushy. It’s like trying to run through mud.

It depends on the music and instruments you’re playing with too. Low tuned toms can quickly get lost in the dinge when electric guitars are in the mix.

Not sure what part two with Carter will reveal. He’s said on more than one occasion that he immediately fell in love with Weckl’s tom sound in the 80s and has been chasing it ever since.

[circh bustom]

Any time ive had the chance to tap or hit with sticks the heads of a "pros" kit ive always been surprised at how slack the heads are. But yet when i go home and tune my kits, i always wind up cranking the heads tighter than they had them. Cranked is the wrong word, but you get my drift.
As for Carter, I have similar equiptment and sizes, Birch Custom Vintage as opposed to RC's, and a 6.5x14 Black Beauty which according to DMBand.com, is what hes been using. Ive chased his sound for years and only when my heads are very slack do I come close to the pop that all his drums have. Toms especially. The snare ive only had for a few months, but was able to acheive a similar sound with a Mapex Black Panther brass 5.5x14 by, you guessed it, detuning the batter head. As mentioned earlier I got my first real lesson in tuning during a recording session in 03 with my Yamahas. After spendingmonths thinking I had just the right tuning, throwing a good mic on the toms proved otherwise. I had to detune the lugs at least a full turn and then the sound blossomed. Now my problem occurs, we've all heard Ocheltree write/talk about Bonham tuning his drums, especially bottom heads waaayyy tighter than you would think and i doubt anyone here would be indifferent or negative about HIS drum sound.
One thing I kept in mind while reading this article was, when was the last time Manu or Carter played a gig where the kit wasnt close mic'ed? About 1/3 of my gigs are close mic'ed. The rest are either kick and an overhead, or no overhead. I always throw my D6 in front of the kick no matter what. This i feel has a significant impact on not just how they tune, BUT the option of tuning way low as well.

[Christopher]

One thing I kept in mind while reading this article was, when was the last time Manu or Carter played a gig where the kit wasnt close mic'ed?

That’s a great point. Close micing (with top of the line mics), a monster PA, all kinds of outboard effects, compressors, eqs and processors, and a whole team of sound people too.

That all tends to help.

Bonham came to mind for me while reading that also. Stewart Copeland too.

[kinkymook]

If I could continue this based on my night at the Bitter End....

The band that played before Oz had a drummer who brought in a Tama kit with an 18" bass drum, 10, 12, and 14 toms, which I immediately noticed were tuned up WAY higher than I would ever tune any of my kits, but when the band started, they didn't sound high at all. In fact, it reminded me of Vinnie's toms on the "Forbidden Chaka" footage. Kind of somewhere in between low and high. At least the 10 and 12.... Also, the guys little kick drum was perfect. I told myself that I was gonna come home and experiment on my Pearl kit ASAP. Joels toms were low and thunderous and this cat's were high and just as appealing. Very strange. BUT, I do a LOT of recording in my home studio which has prompted me to experiment with what sounds best for the mics and it just depends on what you're going for. If you get too muddy in the toms you start getting mixed in with the bass guitar frequencies so you wanna be a step up from that. AND, funny enough, I've recorded some seriously thunderous SmithSmithEraJourney type fills on my 8, 10, 12, 14, tuned up a little higher than usual. All it takes is Eq, reverb, and compression. I seem to remember a Modern Drummer interview during the Journey Trial by Fire album where the interviewer asked Steve if he used bigger drums for that record to recreate that classic Journey sound, and he said no. Just the same drums he's been using for everything else. I thought, there's no way, but I do it here at my studio all the time when needed.
Ah, the mystery of tuning........

[Josiah]

see i thought the trick to getting gadd's drum sound was to take the most expensive drums of the era, put the thickest heads offered at the time, tune them only to the point so the lugs dont rattle, slap an excessive amount of duct tape on them, both sides of course, roll up a huge blunt and don a dashiki...

[Gaddabout]

see i thought the trick to getting gadd's drum sound was to take the most expensive drums of the era, put the thickest heads offered at the time, tune them only to the point so the lugs dont rattle, slap an excessive amount of duct tape on them, both sides of course, roll up a huge blunt and don a dashiki...

Well, that's the first hour, yes ...